A blog for Christian men "going their own way."

Monday, September 8, 2008

Another Stupid Book

Steve Watters at Boundless writes:

Have you seen the book Guyland by Michael Kimmel? I just picked up a copy and started reading it. Kimmel is a professor of sociology at State University of New York, Stony Brook. He's far afield from typical Boundless writers -- in fact Gloria Steinem is one of his book endorsers -- but it appears he has written a valuable book.

Well, Steve, when one is in the habit of bashing men, it does make for strange bedfellows, doesn't it? My take? A culture that steadfastly refuses to address the immaturity of women has no moral authority to address the immaturity of men. That is how I can say this book is stupid without even reading it.

Read more about the Stupid Book here.


Triton said...

One of the commenters said this:

I just ended a relationship with a guy in his 40's who was a total non-committal and is now seeing a woman overseas who is 15 years his junior.

Sounds to me like a guy who knows what he wants. But then, that's what "Guyland" is - men pursuing the things they enjoy and avoiding the things that they don't enjoy. And that just drives the Boundless ninnies nuts.

Anyone want to make a bet about how long it will be before some commenter at Boundless starts complaining about those evil video games? ;)

Amir Larijani said...

Triton: Actually, I would empathize with that commenter, if the relationship was one of him stringing her along. There does come a ppint where a man--once he realizes she is not a compatible help-meet--needs to cut the cord and not string her along.

As for pursuing the things they enjoy--and eschewing the things they do not enjoy--that is a matter of freedom and is with both sexes.

The caveat here is this: both the men and the women need to understand that time is not our friends.

If a woman wants a career and a family, some career choices are more amenable to those goals than others.

If a man wants to be a "free spirit", there are costs--opportunity costs--associated with that.

Ergo, I can understand the need to confront the guyland culture, or at least work to ensure that men who are in guyland temper their desire for the pleasures of life with the acceptance of the large responsibilities of manhood.

The same is true for women in chickland.

The larger issue here is the crisis of men and women not growing up.

This is tangentially related to the issue of protracted singleness, but I'm referring to what I often see in church and at work, and this is not restricted to singles by any stretch.

Elusive Wapiti said...

I submitted the folliwing comment to Boundless a few minutes ago. We'll see if it actually makes it onto their site.

Man I hate comment moderation.

" I wonder if the authors would consider writing a companion volume to this book entitled "Girl-World" or something like that.

No doubt that there is a bit of extended adolescence among men these days, so much so that the "man-as-child" motif gets really old when you hear it over and over.

But is it really that different for women? I mean, just how mature are the women who charge into marriage, only to be the one to dissolve it later, often after children have arrived? How mature are the women who spend the money they earn in the fruitless pursuit of happiness-via-career on clothes and shoes and dining out? Just how mature are the laddettes who drink like unabashed frat boys and pour their sexuality into the street for all to see? And how mature are the women who pursue man-not-included single motherhood?

Seems to me that both sexes have maturity issues these days, but it's only the guys we're hearing about. Personally, I'd like to see both sexes held to the same standard of responsibility.

Posted by: Elusive Wapiti | September 09, 2008 at 06:26 PM

Triton said...

As for pursuing the things they enjoy--and eschewing the things they do not enjoy--that is a matter of freedom and is with both sexes.

That's sort of the point, Amir. The Boundless folks don't buy into that at all; they seem to exist mainly to heap all sorts of un-Biblical burdens upon men. They sincerely believe that a man who prefers playing video games to being married is sinning.

If it were up to them, every man would marry whether he wanted to or not. And he would marry a 30-something middle class American woman, of course; young foreign "mail-order brides" need not apply.

The Boundless crowd gets one thing right - they realize that something is wrong with the state of marriage in this country (and the Anglosphere in general). But their solutions will only make things worse.

Mordecai Lament said...

I'll see if boundless posts this one...

Oh great, here we go again. Let's make men responsible for everything.

The louder evangelicals shout about how I should get married, the less inclined I am. Especially with divorce law being what it is. Of course, this is sanctioned by the American church with evangelicals blaming men for every last thing. Do ya think that maybe, just maybe... men are getting tired of it? Is it any wonder that men do not darken the doors of a church? The men that women are looking for aren't in the church. They're gone. And they're going to stay that way unless evangelicals welcome them. Shaming them is not going to work. We've already tried that.

I guess I fit in this so called extended adolescence stage. And I'm growing tired of being asked, "So... when are you getting married." Or worse, the typical line of "When you get married and have kids..."

Here's a thought... it will happen when it happens and not until. I mean, for crying out loud people, haven't you heard of I Corinthians 7? Oh, wait... you think that's temporary. What then to do with Matthew 19? Edit it out of the Bible?

Face it. Not everyone is going to marry. Some of us are happy as singles. And the idea of a single young male as a second class citizen in the Kingdom galls me.

Read my lips, and get used to hearing it because men are not going to bend their knee to a tradition: Singleness is not a crime. Not wanting to marry is not a sin. Once evangelicals get that through their thick skulls, then we will have something to talk about. Until then, evangelicals will continue to have a cold war on their hands.

Elusive Wapiti said...

Mordecai, they just posted mine...

SavvyD said...

A book on the immaturity of women. I want to see that. Something about the "I'm a Princess: mentality.

SavvyD said...

Well now, wait a minute--playing video games over getting married. Get real. Is playing video games over having a productive social life really the BEST use of one's time? I had female roommates in college who were just as guilty of binging on Civilization or Sim City to the exclusion of everything else for days at a time. No matter your age--young teens included--there are better things you can be doing with your time.